Just getting back from the range with the brand spanking new Ruger LC9, 17.1 ounce 7+1 9mm...initial impressions are that it recoils less than my LCP with Corbin DPX...more when I get home!
A handful of 9mm!
Length differences between LC9 and LCP
Kahr Arms P9
The Kahrs have always been great shooters, but their overall acceptance has been hampered by a relatively high price point...the pictured P9 is $739 MSRP. The lower pirce point in the market has been held down by the Kel-Tec P-11/PF9 series, skating in at a feathery 14 ounces and an MSRP of $333:
Kel-Tec P-11
The Kel-Tecs have their devoted followers, to be sure, but a 14 ounce 9mm is indeed a handful. I have had mixed luck with Kel-Tecs. Last year two years ago Taurus jumped into the market with their "Slim," a slim (natch!) 7+1 9mm, 19 ounce semiauto but a price point of $485, less on the street:
Taurus "Slim" 709B
If you recall, I was very enthusiastic about the Slim, because it brought home a fact that gun companies have often forgotten — width is a critical dimension in a concealed carry gun. As much as I like hte Glock 26 9mm, it's a fat little bastard in the grips and that always ruled it our for me as a carry gun. At various times I have carried an STI-LS9, one of the thinnest single actions available and a superb little gun, and the Para USA Carry 9, again, a single stack 9mm (this one with the Para LDA system).
I recently went to the Ruger SR9c for it's 1911 width grips and the fact that it shot like a house afire (my carry SR9c is out for a set of XS Sights right now). The SR9c clocks in at 23.4 ounces and a lenght of 6.85 inches for its 3 1/2-inch barrel.
The LC9 essentially "splits the baby" between the SR9c and the wildly successful LCP .380.
Ruger LC9...note manual safety
The LC9's length is 6 inches (same as the Taurus Slim, longer than the Kahrs and the Sig) with a barrel length of 3.12 inches. Weight is 17.10 ounces; width of only .90 inches, consistent with the Kahrs, the Slim and the new Sig and compared to the 1.2-ish width of the SR9c. To compare, the LCP has a length of 5.16 inch, a width of .82 and an unloaded weight of 9.4 ounces.
I put about 60 rounds of mixed 124-gr ammo through the gun, most of it WW white box ball. I won't lie to you — the LC9 barks. But interestingly enough when I shot it alongside by LCP with Corbon defense loads, I'd have to say the .380 definitely had a sharper bite. The LC9 agazines come with an optional buttplate with a pinky grip...I've never paid that much attention to similar buttpads for the LCP, but I have to say the extra finger on the grip of the 9mm made a big difference to me. Depending on how the gun carries, my inclination would be to install the extended buttpad on all the magazines. I shot the 60 rounds through 4 magazines and had no malfunctions of any kind, a little surprising since this is a VERY early production model. Watch Wednesday's video podcast...those are the first rounds from the out-of-the-box gun...no break-in, no oil, no nuthin'.
The LC9 has an excellent set of fixed sights (with those annoying 3-dots!), including a dovetailed front. In fact, when I changed from the LC9 to my carry LCP, I really missed the sight picture! The LC9 has a strong-side only manual safety a la the SR series...not really necessary for a long double-action-only trigger, but I'm still going to come down on the side ot "plus." As you all know, I am a huge proponent of a manual safety in a gun carried off-body or in a forward of the hip carry like appendix or forward crossdraw. The gun also has a magazine safety, which sucks. Hopefully, it's as easily removable as the ones in the SR series guns. All four magazines dropped clear, and the mag button is where God and Jphn Browning intended it to be.
The trigger pull is long but not particularly heavy (I ran this gun to the range straight from the FFL person, so I didn't have a lot of my tools and toys with me). Tere is a small bit of roughness — not stacking — at the end of the stroke, but it didn't seem to be an issue with my shooting. The trigger smoothed out some as I shot it.
I did NOT have time to do any accuracy testing, although both Marshal Halloway and I will be pulling that together over the next few days.
Okay, here's the question of the day...is the LC9 a pocket pistol by the conventional definition? I'll give you a qualified "maybe." It's in my pocket now, and weightwise it feels like steel J-frame revolver, but bulkier. I'm ordering a DeSantis pocket holster tonight that should fit the LC9, and I'll let you know.
Do I think Ruger has found the tipping point here? My answer is yes, they have, and in exactly the same way they drove the LCP to best-seller status. There were a host of .380 pocket pistols before the LCP, but the Ruger captured the market with its name recognition, quality, price point and canny mix of features. The LC9 exhibits those very same traits...it's a Ruger, which means that not only will it likely work, but the company will stand behind it. At a $443 MSRP, it's substantially less than the top-end Kahrs (and probably the Sig, which hasn't yet announced the P290's MSRP), but not hugely more expensive than the bottom end. The sights are exceptional; the trigger pretty good. It's a handful, but not an uncontrollable handful.
I think the LC9 will appeal to the Gun Culture Ver. 2.0 people who came into the culture through CCW with a pocket pistol like the LCP and are now ready to step up to a larger caliber. They've had more time behind the gun, understand both shooting and carrying a lot better, and I believe the first gun they're going to be looking at is the one most similar to what they're already carrying.
[iPhone video and photography by the Sweetie]
57 comments:
Well, well -- whoever said that pocket 9s would be the next big thing appears to be correct. Unlike the LCP, the 9 seems to have a thumb safety and a take-down lever, both desirable features IMO. I suppose cocked-and-locked carry is not an option due to legal concerns. What does it weigh?
Never mind...17.1 ounces-...my reading skills are sadly lacking today. I blame Obama.
Hey! They finally got around to copying the PF9. Makes sense for that since the LCP is pretty much a P3AT.
How are they NOT being sued by Kel Tec?
Nothing in Kel-Tec's guns is proprietary (or patentable); we went through this on the LCP...John Browning's patents ran out a LOOOOONG time ago!
mb
Thanks, I'll keep my G26, but tell Ruger and all the others to keep on trying.
Now that new Kel-Tec shotgun...hmmm, maybe.
I'm disappointed that Ruger seems stuck on trying to out do Kel-Tec and Taurus in the cheap plastic disposable gun market. Their target demographic sure has slid downhill away from the enthusiast market.
What's the expected service life on these things, a couple of thousand rounds?
Well, since Ruger went outside the box with the Scout, I'm not going to rag them for putting another Matte Black Half Plastic Special on the market.
Can you imagine what our polished-blue-steel-and-walnut, S&W Triple Lock, Browning Hi-Power, Mauser Broomhandle, '03 Springfield toting forebears would think if they walked into a gun shop today?
Progress... pah!
Dave, I agree with you on that! Still, I love the SR9c I've been carrying...well, not love likevI love the Hamilton Bowen custom single actions...or the hi-zoot 1911s...
mb
"Dave, I agree with you on that!"
Isn't being a crotchety old man awesome? Of course, I was a crotchety young man...
Bane - is the strong side only safety going to be an issue for left handers like me? Bring it to Pawnee, I'd like to see how the size compares to my USP Compact.
- Grizzly Dave
Coincidences abound in life, and this is one of the odd ones.
Yesterday I finally read Bill Jordan's "No Second Place Winner", and I was struck by his assertion that the .22 mag would make a good deep-concealment carry pistol. I started searching the net to see if anyone had built one since Jordan's publish date of 1965.
The answer is no, nobody makes a tiny .22 mag except the screwy looking NAA derringer/revolvers.
But in the process I happened upon the LC9 on the Ruger website, and I thought: "Hmmm .... maybe I should get me one of these. But I don't know anything about it."
One of the problems with the P3AT is that it's so small that it doesn't ride well in my large hands without the finger-stop magazine extension, which seems like a high price to pay with a pistol shooting the wimpy little .380 cartridge. For that snag-in-the-pocket penalty, a man ought to get a little more bang for the buck.
Now I've got a better understanding of what the LC9 is like, and from your comments it sounds like a P3AT with cajones.
Now I'm certain that I oughta get me one of those.
Thanks for the review and post Michael. Great job. This is a very interesting nine but being lefty the non ambi safety is a :(
I may end up with one of these for summer.
Jerry, in "No Second Place Winner", Bill Jordan indicated that an airweight .22 magnum J Frame revolver would make a fine concealment gun. In fact, one Company has made a 7 shot J-Frame that seems just what Jordan was referring to.
S&W 351PD 1.875" 22WMR AIRLITE
• Caliber: .22MAG
• Capacity: 7 Rounds
• Barrel Length: 1 7/8"
• Front Sight: HI-VIZ Front
• Rear Sight: Fixed
• Grip: Wood Grips
• Frame: Small - Chiefs Special Style
• Finish: Black Matte
• Overall Length: 6 1/4"
• Material: Aluminum Alloy
• Weight Empty: 10.6 oz.
I'm suprised that S&W didn't market it as the "Bill Jordan" special. Not sure if it's in the current catalog, but it was available fairly recently.
I carried a Sig P239 for years in 9mm, Yes it was heavier but it went bang every time.
I now carry a G-26 or a G-19. I'm so used to the same trigger pull that the DA/SA Sig seems a bit strange now.
The fact is I shoot the same qualification scores with the G-26 as I do with a G-19. The fat little bastard is a shooter.
Good luck to Ruger. You have to say the management team is trying to put new products out the door for the shooting public.
Ratcatcher55
Jerry the Geek and FM451
Great heads up on that combo of 22M and smitty airweight. Just checked and it is still on S&Ws website and Davidsons has it in stock.
Here is a pic of the LC9 with an LCP overlay:
http://gunmart.blogspot.com/2011/01/ruger-lc9.html
Only concern I have is the bore axis looks rather high. Makes the gun flippy. See, for example, SIGs.
I prefer pistols with low bore axis like Glock, Kahr, 1911, CZ, Smith M&P.
I'm not seeing this light up the pocket-carry market.
Even the PM-size Kahrs have trouble with that (do a quick web search on pocket-carry J-frame-vs-Kahr and wonder for the zillionth time why S&W can't make a light 9x19 J-frame)
The larger Kahr CW's @ ~$425 do pretty well sales-wise, so the Ruger should do well in that niche.
It's a nice try, but not for me. The "strong side only" manual safety is not workable for my strong hand as I'm a lefty. What happens if the safety is inadvetrantly enaged in my pocket holster?
Magazine safety? Really? That sucks like a Kansas twister.
I love the size, caliber, and everything else about it, but the righty only manual safety is a dealbreaker for me. Keep trying Ruger, you are oh so close.
Glock did get it right once. I love my G36. My "girly" hands would not fit around a high caliber, sub-compact, double stack grip. I was excited about the LC9 until I found out the safety was on the wrong side and of course I do not live in a free state (CA).
They should have made it a 6+1 and reduced the height to be closer to the LCP. What makes a gun easy to conceal is the height and thickness, not the lenght. Also, I hope the trigger pull is not as mushy and long as the Kahr PM9. That gun is a joke. By comparison I love the Walther PPS. Short, crisp trigger, no need to worry about reset, but it's a bit square and bulky in my opinion. I don't know why nobody makes a traditional DA/SA pocket 9mm. In any situation where you need to use your gun, aren't you better off in single action? Am I just crazy?
I had a PF-9 and after shooting a couple times I sold it to the first buyer. Problem is this gun actually hurt the hand when shooting. Has this been compared to the LC9? I'm interested in the LC9 but don't want to waste my money like I did with the Kel-Tec
I wish them well, but I see this as a bit of a "miss". Size- & price-wise, it is up against the Kahr CW9, not the PM9 or P9. IMHO, even @ $100 cheaper, it doesn't compete.
I do not know why some people say that the PF9 hurts. I am 60 years old and shot 100 FMJ rounds through my new PF9 last week in one session and my hand was not even red. Perhaps it is because I was brought up in a world of sports and physcial activity rather than joy sticks and keyboards. :) Just look at people shooting on YouTube. They re-adjust their grip after every shot. The gun should not be slamming back into your hand if you have a proper and very tight grip on it.
I will carry my Kimber CDP Ultra cocked and locked with 230 grain+P Ranger Talon loads!
Not the smallest, not the newest but maybe the baddest in the valley of the shadow!
SWAMPHUNTER1 Florida
I really liked my Kahr P9 but it was an unforgivable jam-o-matic even after being warranty serviced. A shame but I'm hopefull the ruger can replace it.
I have an lc9 and am shipping it back to ruger tomorrow.It went bang every time but it shot really low(2 feet@7 yds.).The difference in the two is when i get it back it will work.
I had a Kahr got rid of it. Totaly unreliable. Just got a LC9, recoil with 124 grain bullets is no problem, trigger pull is a bit long but easy to get used to. Shot a little low and right but sight is adjustable and I can remady that. In all I am very pleased with the pistol
I don't know how the whole patent thing works. All I know is that I originally owned a Kel-Tec P3AT and hated it. After I shot a friend's Ruger LCP, I had to have one. The Ruger is leaps and bounds better, and I am seriously looking at buying the LC9. It's like Ruger read my mind...what about a gun slightly bigger, I can get all fingers on, 9x19 cal, and great sights. Hello LC9!
I like my lcp but I do just fine with my G26 and can carry with a in the waist holster just fine so I passed on the LC9 but am a big fan of Ruger.If I feel danger I grab my SP 101 with 357 110GR HP
The LC9 shot extremely well and had no malfunctions of any kind. I highly recommend purchasing this weapon.
This weapon the LC9 shot extremely well and with no malfunctions. I highly recommend purchasing this weapon.
Everyone seems to dislike the magazine safety. Well, I like it as a feature for young people who have kids in the house. Keep the chamber loaded and the mag in your pocket and no chance for an accident. Good move Ruger. I don't care for the "manual safety" feature but would choose to just ignore it. All the lefties who have commented could go that route as well. If that helps them sell the new item then more power to them. I will, God willing, acquire one of these asap and keep my LCP for "backup" to the LC9. I also like the idea of "supporting Arizona businesses" by purchasing products from that state. That's why my wife and I both have LCP's. Maybe we'll BOTH get LC9s too.
I have owned two PF9s and recently bought an LC9. I find the LC9 a great gun for carry. The PF9 can be inconsistent in accuracy and I had trouble with the take-down pin shearing the head in heavy use. The Ruger LC9 seems to be much better. Don't skimp where your life may depend on your equipment!
I have an LCP and so far it is FLAWLESS. I have well over 1500 rounds without 1 malfunction and I have fed every type of bullet I can through it. I also belong to a forum that a member there runs a range and they have a rental LCP, just over 400,000 rounds and it finally had to be sent into Ruger, which by the way is a lifetime warranty. So, all I can say is this is a great gun, great price, and very well worth every penny. I have no experience with the similar Keltec, however I have a friend with the 9mm version, and his jams, fails to feed quite often. JMHO :)
Just to let everyone know the Mag disconnect and safety can be removed with a little mechanical experience. If you look in the manual of rugers blown up pic of the LC9 disassembled and every piece labeled/numbered, its part#'s 11/12 that need to be removed, then every thing just put back together like before. I have pretty detailed instructions if anyone is interested in doing it and i highly recommend getting the instructions first as it will save you A LOT of time, both safeties can be removed and gun back together within 20min. if you know what you're doing, but the trigger mechanism is pretty complicated and some springs will pop out so you have to know which springs need to be turned which way so theres correct tension on the trigger mechanism. I've read of a couple people who tried it with the less detailed directions i found and they obviously werent too mechanical friendly because a guys trigger wasnt resetting and all he had to do was turn the spring on the right side of the slide the opposite direction to put tension the other way. Simple things like that can screw the gun up and it wont function so if you do try it, i take no responsibility if you mess up your gun so do it at your own risk!! However it isnt complicated so if you dont like the mag disconnect go to glcoktalk.com or PM me and ill send you the detailed directions i wrote up. BTW ~150 rounds fired through it so far without a hiccup! My LC9 shot ~3-4in. to the left out of the box so i had to adjust the rear sight, but it seems on now i just need to test it at the range one more time. But even with sights off and me compensating, at ~15yds. i had ~4in. group my first time shooting this gun eith my last 14 rounds. Not bad IMO and i know it's only going to get better with practice!
The LCP was a GREAT little gun but don't waste your money on the LC9 - - Mine isn't worth risking it if you had to use it - - The darn thing shoots about 2 1/2 feet low at 20 yards and about 6 to 8 in. side to side - - Aim at the head and you will end up hitting around the belt line!!
Carried a M9 for many years and when using it in combat thought it to be a great weapon for it's intended use. Bought the LC9 first purchase of a small arm in last 20 years. It's a great weapon..easy to carry , very accurate, nice sights, not crazy about all the safety features but doesn't bother me already took the mag safety off and the load vent and manual safety doesn't effect me..the weapon ois very reliable three osf us have one now and many hrs at the range provides us with accurate and reliable shooting platform. Carrying it concealed on hip and in front pocket is easy and convenient but lastky the Ruger quality and macining is excellent on this weapon quality built in ..
I am reading some of these comments about accuracy I don't know what the problem is but three of us are hitting right where we want and all of us are comat vets and in law enf...if the weapon system isn't accurate its either you or the weapon send it back at 15-20 yards its should be right o the money within a few inches every round..and thats its intended purpsoe so if its inaccurate send it back to Ruger they will give you a new barrel and sights ..look inside the wepaon and see the machined parts and copmpare them with a Tauras and Kahr and you wil see the quality far exceeds the competition..
I agree with some of the other comments here ... the LC9 is very accurate in my hands and so far no problems its reliable and acuurate and quality parts nicely finished ..compared to KelcTech and Kahr it is superior in construction.. any problems with it return it to Ariz and they will make it right .. easy to conceal also ..the balckhawk lc9 hip holster is great..I also removed the mag safety easy job ..and the manual safety and slide that shows loaded doesn't bother me at all ..
Answers for left handed Dolts like me.
I own an new Lc9 and can easily operate the safety with my index finger.
The magazine button is also a breeze because of its location.
This has become my ccw of choice.
Got my LC9 yesterday - spent a couple hours making it ready to fire by THOROUGHLY cleaning it first. Took it to the range and tossed 90 rounds of white box through it...and am more than impressed. Barks like the big dogs, puts a fair chunk of lead down range with a quickness, and went bang every time.
I wasn't going for accuracy today, just testing and starting the break-in, but still hit the paper plate at 30 feet 100% of the time.
Overall based on today's shoot, thinkin me and the little fella are going to be friends.
Whatever you do with the LC9 DO NOT USE Steel Jackets!!!It will JAM!!
I'm pretty new to concealed carry, pn the verge of buying an LC9 and you folks have helped me get past a few of my doubts about this gun. But what about the FMJ ammo. What do you use for practice?
Fully adjustable for comfort,with a back swivel to help straps lay flat for good concealment and comfortable,versatile shoulder holster systems.
www.chiefsupply.com/search/galco.aspx
Bought a LC9 yesterday and shot it for the first time today. It ate everything that I fed it and it feels good in the hand. All the safety features isn't a big deal in my mind. You can carry with the safety on or if you don't want a safety just leave it off. Accuracy was good. I'm not a avid shooter but threw a golf ball on the ground at around 20 feet or so and hit it the second shot. It flew up into the woods, it was cool. This will be my full time carry gun. Good job Ruger.
Someone commented they did not ike the magazine safety... I personally don't like the magazine safety feature on MY gun, but having worked numerous shootings in my EMS career, over half of them could have been prevented with one of these. Kids always removed the clip, and thought was unloaded, or racked it once, seeing no shell pop out (because they just now chambered the first) they then removed the clip, pointed at a friends head and pulled the trigger. Numerous over my 25 year career. Based on that, I can live with it!
Lots of great posts here on the LC9 and after some time at the range with it I'm about to get one. The only problem I had with it is the long trigger pull. Has anyone found a good way to shorten the pull or is that nor possible?
I have a LC9 that I have changed over to XS Sights "Big Dot Express Sights". I cant say enough how nice this combination of sights and gun is. Accuracy and speed with this package along with the plus of the tritium insert on the front sight makes this gun twice the package it was than when I first opened the box when it was new. Just my own oppinion, a great dependable and fun gun.
I'm new to cc. I shopped for a 9m for quite a while. There are to many choices. I finally made my decision based on what I was originally trying to do. Find a concealable 9mm. I've had my LC9 about a month now. It's small, concealable, and not really obvious. I don't care for the DAO but I am getting used to it. I think it will serve my purpose well.
Would you give your opinion on the best and lightest concealed carry pistol on the market, thanks looking forward to your opinion.
I agree. I prefer SA. That being said, the LC9 fits very well in the hand with the baseplate mags. I'm a 1911 guy, so I'm considering the sig p238. And yes .380 will do the job just fine compared to 9mm. We're not talking about shooting competitions, trying for 1in groupings at 25 yards. We're talking about saving your life at 2-20 ft. I've seen shattered ribs, and 8in penetrations from .380 wounds, as well as fatalities. It'll take the fight out of any aggressor who's not wearing body armor. But the LC9 is cheaper to own (both cost of the weapon and ammo are cheaper). The LC9 may be worth retraining on a DA platform.
After trying several 380.'s, the clerk remembered a just arrived LC9. Nice overall finish and fit. Also rested well in my hands, left and right, just a little better than the others, both auto and revolver. The 3 dots were a plus. Also came with a new school, too high tech for me laser chingadera.
Took the LC9 through a box of 50 for familiarity purposes. Easy enough to fire, placing 10" shot groups on the paper by the 45th round.
Other than the very long trigger travel I won't complain. For me, all it needs is a slightly puffier hand grip.
An easy to shoot, easy to fit in my front pants pocket, 7+1 9mm with rounded edges. in a word, "outstanding!"
I just purchased the LC9 for my wife (I carry a Kahr MK9, and except for the weight, I love it). Took it to the range and at 21 feet it consistently puts a full mag in 3" groups. Recoil is dramatically less than my S&W airweight 38 spl with 125 gr. Flawless function. Mine came with the Lasermax (on/off switch too far fwd to activate with the trigger finger, but workable if time permits). Ruger has a solid winner with this one.
I just bought a new Ruger LC9 yesterday, I put about 100 rounds through it (Cold outside!) I really like this compact(pocket) 9mm! mine came with the factory installed Lasermax laser. I am still undecided on whether I like it or not(lasermax). I did, however, remove it before I shot the 100 rounds. I haven't shot with the lasermax installed. Handling it and dry firing only. It seems that the Lasermax housing adds thickness to the entire length of the trigger guard on the gun, . This places your fingers and hand, lower on the grip.
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