Saturday, February 21, 2009

Dare to Struggle; Dare to Win

From World Net Daily, via Matt Bracken:
National Guard scraps plans to invade rural town
'This operation could be pretty intrusive to the people'

DES MOINES, Iowa – Following publicized reports that the Army National Guard was planning a military training exercise on the streets of a rural Iowa town, the commanding officers have called off the mock "invasion."

The Guard had planned a four-day urban military operation in tiny Arcadia, Iowa, population 443, sending troops to take over the town and search door-to-door for a suspected weapons dealer.
And while Hapgood confirmed the Guard had been inundated with objections from citizens concerned about soldiers patrolling the streets of an American town, he said most came from people out of state and unfamiliar with the operation. Iowans, he explained, typically cooperate with the Guard. The change in plans was based on troop evaluation, he said, not public outcry.
Of course not! And thank you, Americans, for standing up!


Anonymous said...

Waiting for the apologists to chime in....

Apology, a great way to support your local fascist.

Anonymous said...

Walt may remember when the PA NG "invaded" Chester and forgot to tell anybody but the chief of police. Big screw up and many unhappy people.

These type of training exercises have been going on for years by both the NG and AR units.

As stated before, this is a way to train soldiers on a limited budget. I have acted as a red team member on these things in the past in the 70's and 80's and they can be very eye opening for both troops and command staff.

Had the press officer started with, "In preparation for possible overseas deployment....this would be a non-issue.

Don’t make the Reservists and Guards the enemy, there trying to accomplish more missions with less real dollars every year. I doubt many of them are big BO supporters.

Ratcatcher 55

Anonymous said...

Ratcatcher, so what you're saying is that this was just sort of a "starving student" gun confiscation exercise?

Were you paying attention during the Katrina gun confiscations? Have you heard about this Holder AG creep and his gun seizure plans? Do you expect a bell to ring out of nowhere, when the REAL gun confiscation danger occurs? (other than your front doorbell?)

It's nice of the Natl. Guard to let us know what they're planning though, and you have to be thankful for the heads up. Just hope your head isn't under the sand, so you miss it!

Read this part of the article again:
"One of the techniques we use in today's political environment is cordon and knock," Kots explained. "We ask for the head of the household, get permission to search, then have them open doors and cupboards. The homeowner maintains control. We peer over their shoulder, and the soldier uses the homeowner's body language and position to protect him."

Any questions?

Hobie said...

I wrote and asked, as a former ARNG full-timer, about some of the training goals, legal parameters, coordination with civilian authorities and SAFETY for the soldiers. You know that SOMEBODY wouldn't get the word...

Anonymous said...

So not only will they trample on people's rights, with the acquiesence of those people, but they'll use the homeowners as shields, too. 'Cause everyone knows bad guys hang out in cupboards...

Frankly, they won't learn much about 'body language' by watching innocent volunteers, either.

Anonymous said...

What an ass covering press release. Why didn't they just bus the boys up to Chicago and do the "training" exercise for REAL?

Overload in Colorado said...

There was another US city (Cleveland?) they've been training in for YEARS, until it was shut down in 07-08.

Anonymous said...

Dearest Anonymous,

Yes you always keep anybody but team mates and children between possible explosives and other threats. Let them take the bullet or blast.

You fight the way you train. But I guess you wouldn't know that.

Ratcatcher 55

Anonymous said...

Ok now that the exercise has been cancelled, those opposed have responsibilty for these NG troops and their training. YOU BROKE IT, YOU OWN IT.

You should be thinking hard how you are going to train troops who may end up in the sandbox. Cause their blood is on YOUR HANDS.

Anonymous said...

Some folks replying here have some VERY serious recto-cranial inversion.
I'm speaking about those that think this is great training for the sandbox and one who thinks that "the blood is on our hands."

That is all bullshit.

I'm supposed to let armed govt. idiots cordon off my neighborhood and let them search my house and that's a good idea??

What if the FNG thinks he sees something that I shouldn't have? Something that is legal but he's not comfortable with Joe Citzen having it.

What if this same FNG wears a LEO uniform when he's not dressed to go to Kabul High School for career day?
Still thinking this is a good idea?
If you do, reread sentence one, then look in the mirror. Let them in *your* freaking house if you feel this is so neat.

Their lack of resources and training could probably be met if the Dept of Def. bought one less F-22 Raptor. 361 million could ship a lot of people to PROFESSIONAL training sites in a desert environment.

Anonymous said...

Anon 12:26

I am sure that your trailer park wouldn't be the focus of a NG training exercise.

Anonymous said...

GOOD!!!!! In Iraq or Afganistan what the hell would they be looking for a "dealer"? A ter with a AK or a weapons casche would be more in line. I think they tipped their hand. Our dealers are licensed - so far. And it bothers me about the "would you shoot us civilians" question being asked of troops. Most unsettling was the video interview I saw of a young troop saying "yes" in answer to that question. Didn't we hang a lot of Germans for "just following orders"? Illegal orders are illegal to follow. Or did they change that since I was in. the mushroom

Anonymous said...

some S3 type who planned this is going to get transferred to the motor pool before it is all over

how, in a post Katrina world, could any idiot planning an op be so tone deaf to the implications of staging something like this and putting it all in the context they used...

naivity at it's worst

and hey NJ_Larry, at least we are allowed to own firearms without having them regestered and load up with hollowpoint ammo in my trailer park (unlike the subjects of the state trapped in the Peoples Republik of NJ)...ha!

Mr. Rogers said...

The military needs to stay out of my house or anyone esle's. that's why the army has mout sites for this type of training.

closed said...

NJ_Larry: Your standards of what constitutes acceptable behavior by troops or police are only considered acceptable in places like NJ, NY City, and Chicago. The rest of the nation has not allowed themselves to be conditioned to that level of obedience.

We have a very low tolerance for this kind of crap in the rest of the US.

I think someone will come up with a better solution to training after this.

( one other note: you might want to rethink that "trailer trash" notion ... I have never lived in one in my life. I'm a city boy ... although someone from the Bos-Wash corridor would probably dismiss Portland as a small town ... fine. What this trailer-trash comment of your's shows is just a bit of bigotry. If your intent was to persuade, you might want to find a better means. )

Anonymous said...

Kbarret I will respond to your post because it was at least civil (the other moron I won't). I respond to aggression in kind.

As for "acceptable behavior of troops or police" I suggest you read David Codrea's blog. Cops all over have their share of scum. In fact the small towns of America tend to have less if any oversight and are rife for cop abuse. And I want to politely remind ya that Bull Connor wasn't from NY.

As for troops, I respect those young men from ALL over that join and serve this nation. Young kids to "old" guys are DYING in the Middle East. Regulars and Guard troops. 4000 dead so far. If they ask or want training I say don't even blink. Give it to them. I don't suppose to know the defense budget well enough that I'm going to tell the Pentagon which weapons system or program to fund or not. Clearly units go without in lots of areas these days.

In the Middle East young 18 and 19 yr old kids are busting down doors and looking for bad guys. Check out the video on the NRA website from last years annual meeting. Marcus Luttrell (medal of honor - Navy SEAL) tells of busting down doors. Killer dangerous. EXACTLY what this National Guard unit was training for. So if they want to improvise something in town, fine. The military can't train for everything in some shoot house or the couple of "towns" they have. There are hundreds of thousands of troops that rotate thru the ME theatre. This isn't you and friend at Gunsite. As has been said elsewhere the military has been doing similar exercises for decades. Chill.

I am also convinced that most of America doesn't give a crap about our troops or the war anymore. Out of sight out of mind. Their bored by the war. But guys are still dying. The old poem by Kipling serves good stead here. Read "Tommy". Just a reminder, 3000New Yorkers died on Sept 11. Its NY that has taken the hits for America.

The Muslim fanatics are still out there. They still want to kill lots of Americans. And it doesn't matter to them where the hell your from. They want to kill you, kill your wife and disembowel your kids. That is quite the immediate need, folks !

I am NOT afraid of the same guys that are fighting FOR me over there or supplementing police forces across the nation to guard trains, downtowns etc. They are my neighbors and friends. I am NOT going to demonize them.

What really pisses me off is the attitude like its ok to gin up the masses over a stupid training exercise. That is an Al Sharpton trick. And guess what happens? You have some idiot who is going to spit on a young service guy because he thinks that "their gonna take over the nation", "gonna take my guns away". "Not me, I'll shoot the bastards". That's the ignorant attitude that gets brewed. And one idiot or several, will hurt some guys in uniform. Well that is BS.

This has been growing on the web for a while now. All the venom from the election is still circulating. Its outlet is Sipsey stuff or even MB's comments. Heck Tom Gresham even ranted about it on Sunday. Its irresponsible. Someone is going to get hurt and that is inexcusable. You have a beef that something is not politically correct (your version of pc) then pick up the damm phone and call the base commander. Express to them why you might be concerned. But if the commander stays "woops sorry" take it for what its worth. A damm apology and move on.

I'm telling you that the level of violent talk over this stuff is going to cause us all harm. You want your guns taken away then keep it up. Someone "acting out" will give the perfect excuse for exactly what you don't want.

I'm done. Last post on this.

Anonymous said...

Huh... and I thought we invaded Iraq because they were going to set up an oil bourse that traded in Euros instead of US dollars.

And why are we in Afghanistan again?

Is it for a gas pipeline or is it to control the poppy fields?

I forgot.

@ nj-larry...yeah, you're right... It's the American military that is at war. The rest of America is at the mal, picking out the latest iPod or iPhone.

War? What war?

That's just a wee bit of sarcasm.

I do support our troops. Heck, I used to be one of them. Why I even used to be an "Oh", and I done graduated from one of the most presitigious military "colleges" in the whole wide world too.

Yessir, I am all for the troops, I'm just not all hip to either the rationale or the policy that has our sons and daughters on the other side of the world fighting for what? against a foe who is too chickenshit to fight and would rather have kids trigger bombs and booby traps with garage door opener remotes.


from my little red book, a little something I had to memorize once:

"...when there is a long, slow struggle, with no immediate visible foe... your choice will seem hard indeed..."

That was JFK speaking at the graduation for the Annapolis class of 1961, I think.

Oh... heck... while were yammering on about the military, you might recall that the oath you took... that you swore "was to protect the US Constitution against all enemies, foreign, and domestic."

That last bit there about domestic that might turn out to be very prophetic at some point.

Kinda eerie, when you stop and think about it.

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